Monday, July 21, 2008

Limited Atonement

The Blog of Steele has not yet died. While Cris and I are in Romania, The Blog of Steele is going to serve as a location for me to post theological based topics that are generally longer than our typical Romania update. I do not want to distract from the update function of our blog www.steeleromania.blogspot.com with a lengthy post on theology. That’s why I have The Blog of Steele.

Today’s post is about the Calvinistic doctrine of Limited Atonement. I must confess that before today I knew little about this doctrine. I had heard about it because it is one of the five points of Calvinism. The other four points total depravity, unconditional election, irresistible grace, and perseverance of the saints, are doctrines that I am very familiar with and know where they come from in scripture. However I was not aware of the source of limited atonement.

Briefly I will state what limited atonement is. The doctrine is an attempt to answer the question, “For whom did Christ die?” It answers, “For the elect only and not for the whole world.” The proof comes from verses that call Christ a “ransom for many” and not all, prayers that Christ prayed specifically for His elect and not the whole world, (look at John 17,) and perhaps most strongly John 11:49-52.
“And one of them, Caiaphas, being high priest that year, said to them, “You know nothing at all, nor do you consider that it is expedient for us that one man should die for the people, and not that the whole nation should perish.” Now this he did not say on his own authority; but being high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the nation, and not for that nation only, but also that He would gather together in one the children of God who were scattered abroad.” – John 11:49-52
The argument is that Jesus died for the nation (of Israel) and to gather the children of God who were scattered abroad. This does not include non-believers anywhere, so then we should not include non-believers as the recipients of Christ’s death. I would agree with them if this were the only verse on the issue.

I learned some of this yesterday as I was reading The Sovereignty of God by Arthur W. Pink in a section he titled “The Sovereignty of the Son in Salvation.” This section was essentially a defense of limited atonement. I read his proof, and then read how he dealt with the problem texts, and came away with the conclusion that Pink’s arguments were really weak. The problem texts for limited atonement seemed stronger than the texts in its favor, (1 Timothy 2:5-6, 1 John 2:2, 2 Corinthians 5:14-15…) so I left perplexed.

1 John 2:2 is the strongest of these verses. It states, “And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.” In what sense can Christ be the propitiation for the whole world? Pink argues that “world” here refers to Gentile believers by trying to show the John’s audience in 1 John was Jewish. It is a weak argument. John Piper agrees with Pink and connects a grammatical similarity between 1 John 2:2 and John 11:52, and from that attempts to prove that world here means the Christians who were not in John’s immediate community. Their arguments do not appear to be satisfactory. 1 John 2:2 is not a stand-alone text. 1 Timothy 2:6 speaks of Jesus being a “ransom for all.” 2 Corinthians 5:14 states “one died for all.” John 1:29 speaks of the “Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.” Hebrews 2:9 says that He “might taste death for everyone.” In John 6:51 Jesus speaks of his flesh saying “which I shall give for the life of the world.” This list is not exhaustive.

I do not feel that the Calvinists provide sufficient answers for these scriptures. The answers are always, “well in this passage world means all types of people in the world from whom He will save some,” or “all here means all the children of God.” These claims do not always seem to be fully supported by the context, especially claims made against 1 Timothy 2:6. The context shows that verse six is talking about the whole world, because everyone in the world is referenced in verse 4.

I had to come to the conclusion that limited atonement is not taught by the scriptures. It appears to me to be a doctrine created to allow consistency with the other four points of Calvinism. The question that I am asking myself right now is, “How can the atonement of Christ extend to every man if all are not saved?” The most common answer in theology is that of the Arminian which says that God has endowed men with free will and they reject the gift that was already offered to them. I think that this view denies scripture as well. I found myself in a predicament. How can I deny limited atonement and still believe in God’s sovereignty in choosing who is saved? Scripture testifies clearly that God predestines men to salvation. (Read Romans 8:29-30, Romans 9, Ephesians 1, John 6, John 10, John 17…) So how can Christ have died for someone He knew would never be saved?

I came up with a couple of possible solutions. First, I thought, well perhaps the propitiation of 1 John 2:2 is what allows non-believers to live life and receive common grace before judgment, while it is efficacious for believers. This sounded good, but I realized that this is never taught in scripture, so I dropped it. I pondered a few more possibilities before coming to a realization (that I believe was the Lord) in thinking that Christ’s death is infinite.

Would Christ have had to suffer more if He died for the entire world that He did if He died only for the elect? His suffering was already infinite. How do you add to infinity? His death does not seem to have a limit as if he died for this sin and not for that one. This distinction does not seem to make sense to me. You cannot add to infinity. Perhaps Christ’s death extends to the whole world, but is only received by those whom God chose to have faith in His Son. In this sense the atonement is unlimited, but it is received only by those that God chose to receive it. Christ still died for everyone, but in His good pleasure, not all will taste the full everlasting benefits of Christ’s death. This allows God to pour out common grace on unbelievers like rain and wealth without compromising his justice towards people who deserve to be sent to hell immediately.

Basically, I have proposed that the infinity of Christ’s sacrifice answers all the paradoxes surrounding this doctrine, and that the distinctions made by theologians are not biblical or relevant. The passages like John 11:49-52 are true, because Christ’s death is effectual only for the elect, but passages like 1 John 2:2 are true as well, because his death is extended to everyone, in that it cannot be contained or found insufficient for any payment.

11 comments:

Anonymous said...

1) First of all: I agree with you with regards to Pink. He is very passionate and eloquent, but has some very weak arguments that are not of his own design. I recently read this chapter as well and it was very weak.

2) I think that the words selected for ‘Limited Atonement” are of poor choice and taste seeing that it is limiting our most infinite God. The term is not very old, only a couple hundred years and I tend to reject it as well, but only in terms, because to limit God is foolishness.

3) I do have to disagree with you on your reaction to the doctrine. I do think that it is biblically founded as it is a necessary part of election. If God elects, then he must only atone for those that he has chosen otherwise God is either/or:

A) Not sovereign
B) Not powerful
C) Not good.
I think that you agree with election and substitutionary atonement which logically warrants the necessity of limited atonement/particular redemption.

4) Having stated that, theologically, this is an artificial problem founded on man’s speculation and assumption of knowledge which he does not possess. This reminds me much of infralapsarianism versus supralapsarianism dabate whereas man tries to make judgement calls on what God has done. I would have to state that logically and theologically it makes sense for me to take up this doctrine seeing my Christian perspective, but functionally an Arminian perspective should operate exactly the same as the Calvinistic perspective. This is true because the Arminian Christian has a heart to have the whole world to be saved and pursues that end because he believes in the potential for the whole world to be saved and the Calvinistic Christian wants to pursue bringing the lost into the fold of God not knowing who belongs to that fold and thusly he tries to reach the whole world to share the Gospel with the “lost” (aka. lost sheep). Theologically different. Functionally the same.

5) Biblically, I tend to line up with the Calvinistic perspective on this issue scripturally. One has to be very careful with statements such as “all” and the “whole world.” What is “world” referring to? The landmass of which we live on? Probably not. The whole of creation? Probably not. All people? I don’t know… lets check out the context like I have with the other few questions.

In analyzing the context, I urge you to ignore verse numbers, headings, and paragraphs entirely. They are artificial tools and are not helpful in this case. So, lets start:

A) Who is the author of I Timothy and to whom was it addressed?
B) What is the purpose of I Timothy?
C) What is the significance of the passage in question?
D) How does it relate to material previously presented in the letter?

Well, I Timothy was presumably written from Paul to Timothy to encourage him pastorally. Paul starts off the letter by addressing Timothy and then warns him to safeguard the Gospel against false teaching. Then in chapter 2, he goes into talking about who we should pray for: all people. This includes those in high positions so that we may lead quiet and godly lives because they can enable this. These prayers are good and it is pleasing in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all people to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth. I’ll stop here because I think that this is the part that are having trouble with. I would tend to think from the context that “all people” is not referring to a general “all people” (individuals), but considering the context is that of prayer and that Paul gives Timothy an example of one such prayer and reason, I can only assume that Paul is talking about all demographics of people, not individuals. God wants to have all races, genders, classes, etc. to be saved because he elected peoples of all nations tribes and tongues. That is how I would reconcile that passage, but I also reject God having two wills (permissible and sovereign). If you think that God does have these two wills, then the problem is easily reconcilable in his secretive will.

6) In conclusion, I would have to also state that I think that this is a biblical doctrine with (from my experience) you having already brought up the greatest argument against it in the form of I Timothy 2:6. There are many other passages in Hebrews (concerning substitutionary atonement) that could support this doctrine, but I think that primarily you are correct in assuming that this is more of a logical conclusion than a biblical one. The Bible does not tend to directly speak for or against the subject other than that we know that:

1) Not all people will be saved
2) God is sovereign
3) God elects
4) God used/uses himself (ie His Son) as a substitutionary sacrifice.

A few passages seem to contradict this, but, in context it seems as if they resolve themselves whereas those doctrines above are unquestionably biblical and would not/could not resolve themselves if left out of the picture of our Christian beliefs. This is why I tend to hold the doctrine of ‘limited atonement’ however poorly named and speculative it may be.

Paul said...

Jon, before I really get into anything, let me say that Piper has a really good article on the Two Wills scenario that I found quite convincing at http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibrary/Articles/ByDate/1995/1580_Are_There_Two_Wills_in_God/

Ok, onto the meat of the discussion. I agree with your four points at the end of the post. From these points it appears that limited atonement is a necessary logical conclusion. However, I want to subject my logic to the counsel of scripture, especially when dealing with speculative doctrines such as this one.

I can't read the "all men" in 1 Timothy 2:4 as anything other than, well, all men. This reading makes any rendering of "all" in verse six quite unlikely. I feel like I'm twisting the text to make it say what I want it to say if I do any other.

Another thing is that there are so many references to Christ's being an atonement for "all," "everyone," and "the world" in scripture for them all to have ways to explain them away in context. It feels like the Arminian trying to explain all the references to "predestined" and "elect." You can make cases, but eventually the entire mass of arguments to avoid the obvious betrays the attempt to mold scripture into man's image. I don't want to do that.

I don't know what sense Christ's death atones for unbelievers. Perhaps it is a penal price to offer them common graces. Perhaps it enables the "longsuffering" of Romans 9:22. I don't know. However, I don't believe that is forces one of the three conclusions you mentioned.

I really don't think that this little discovery changes my beliefs at all really. What it does is prevents me from calling myself a five point Calvinist. I think I'm cool with that. I would be glad to renounce my allegiance to Calvin and confirm my allegiance to scripture.

Anonymous said...

Sorry, after some thought, I decided to post a second part to my response.



“Basically, I have proposed that the infinity of Christ’s sacrifice answers all the paradoxes surrounding this doctrine, and that the distinctions made by theologians are not biblical or relevant. The passages like John 11:49-52 are true, because Christ’s death is effectual only for the elect, but passages like 1 John 2:2 are true as well, because his death is extended to everyone, in that it cannot be contained or found insufficient for any payment.”

This I fully agree with and this is the spirit of the idea of “Limited Atonement.” It seems though as if you are actually answering your question by proposing the question as the answer.

Christ’s death cannot ever be found void, but it is painfully obvious and clear that God does not save all people and that he does not want to save all people (hence God’s elect not being all of humanity). The entire passages of Romans 8-9 proclaim this and show forth God’s sovereign choice. God does not desire to save all, otherwise he would do so as the very concept of election states otherwise and that is unquestionable in its clarity in scripture. Furthermore, God’s sovereign choice is illustrated in the analogy presented in divine scripture of God being the potter and him having the ability to make vessels of both honorable and dishonorable usage. That is what the concept is.

In light of your conclusion, I think that you are mistaking the relevant, necessary, and scriptural concept of Limited Atonement with one of its irrelevant, non-scriptural, and artificial potential results. Limited atonement is not that Christ’s sacrifice is only sufficient to redeem certain humanity and that it is precise in its exactitude and power accomplish only such. By no means! God is infinite (as you stated earlier) and the beauty and necessity of substitutionary atonement is that because of the infinite worth of God that sin transgresses, a sacrifice of equal infinite worth must be made if God would want to redeem those that sin.

Instead of the above idea, I would suggest that Limited Atonement is a concept that states that Christ’s sacrifice is a sufficient payment for all things, but that the scope of the Cross is only directed towards God’s elect. There are only three ways that the cross can be applied to humanity:

1) All of humanity is justified.
2) Some of humanity is justified.
3) None of humanity is justified.

If it were directed towards all people the either:

1) All of humanity would be saved and believe.
2) All of humanity would be saved and not believe.

As you can see, neither of the above is either true or just according to Scripture and the revealed character of God himself. If none of humanity were to be justified in God’s sight, then we wouldn’t have the Gospel and we probably would not be having this discussion. The only conclusion that I can arrive at is that some of humanity is justified by God in His sovereignty, by faith alone, in Christ alone, through grace alone, for the express purpose of His glory alone.

The conclusion that I come to is this:

“Limited Atonement” is the statement that Christ’s death is sufficient for all things, but limited to whom it is applied to. The scripturally affirmed conclusion is that Christ’s death is effective for a number of people who have had, have, or will have faith (the elect) and that specific number of people is unknown to us. As such, Christ’s death is not effective for those who do not have faith (not God’s elect) because the requirements that God has set forth for sinful man to be justified before him have not been met by the person (ie. faith). This is in sharp contrast to a person not being saved due to a lack of the power of God; instead, people are not saved because he does not desire for all of humanity to be saved. This glorifies Him.

Upon such passages as I Timothy 2, I invoke the hermeneutical rule of interpreting unclear scripture by clear scripture. If it seems to contradict clear Scripture, then I am probably misinterpreting either the unclear passage or the comparative clear passage. Considering that it is painfully clear that God elects in Scripture and God is all powerful, love, just, and truth; then he cannot desire to save all people otherwise all people would be saved and all people would be his elect. Seeing that this contradicts both Scripture and experience (seeing that some people recorded in Scripture notably did not have faith and were therefore not His elect), this interpretation of I Timothy 2 is incorrect and if scripture is the Word of God (meaning that it is inerrant, infallible, and contains all that is necessary for faith), then I must be interpreting I Timothy 2 incorrectly. Therefore, if I should desire to understand it correctly, I should go back and reinvest time and prayer in following the Holy Spirit to show me what that passage means and how it can applied in my life as a Christian.

I have repeated myself several times and I hope that you understand my perspective and my argument. It probably is no stronger than Pink’s and for that I apologize. I would like to hear what your response is either as a comment or as an email sometime. Take care Paul!

Anonymous said...

Hahah. You posted your response while I posted my second comment. Sorry :x.

Anonymous said...

The only thing that I want to present to you is a picture of what Limited Atonement is before you fully reject it. I wish to do so as it does not seem like you have the whole picture in view, but have gotten stuck on a very minor, debatable, and irrelevant point of the doctrine instead of taking in the whole thing into account. As a friend: you have had a tendency in the past to not be able to see the forest for all of the trees. I could not care less about Calvinism or about the five points in and of themselves (because they are merely human constructions), but, I do care that you make an informed decision (even if it is different from my opinion or council) and I am not sure that you have done so yet.

I hope that these blog posts only show forth truth spoken in love to someone I deeply admire and respect and I hope that you are doing well over in Romania!

Paul said...

There ar elots of long posts and arguments here, but I think they miss the point.

I would agree with limited atonement if the doctrine were limited to saying that only those people that God chooses to be saved will be saved. Option two is correct. Some of humanity will be justified. There are two similar statements that could be made.

1. Justification extends to all people.
2. Christ's death extends to all people.

I think that denying the first is biblical and denying the second is not.

Limited atonement denies both. I do not think I can apply your hermenetical rule to a whole class of scripture. If ten different verses all seem to suggest the same thing, applying this rule and clasifying them all as "unclear" ignores the witness of the Bible. This would be appropriate is 1 Timothy 2:6 was the only verse in the Bible that says that. But we have 1 John 2:2, 2 Cor. 5:14-15 and many others. I listed quite a few more in my original post.

My problem is that I canot ignore these verses, and I do not think that Limited Atonement is viable in light of these scriptures.

Dave said...

Limited atonement is a bad name for the doctrine. It is particular redemption. I do believe it is biblical. The strongest evidences in the Bible come from a few sources.

1) The Bible in no way separates Christ's death from his actual atonement. Christ can scarcely be said to die for someone if he does not also redeem them.

2)The nature of atonement in the Temple system does not allow one to seperate the sacrifice, from offering that sacrifice, from actually atonement and propitiation. The whole ritual is unbroken. Hewbrews portays this act as a Shadow of Christ.

3) The day of atonement sacrifice was to atone for a particular people. Not the world.

4)Christ death is said to actually atone. Not make it possible. It is said to actually redeem. Not just be a price for it. It is said to purchase sinners. Not just make make it possible. It is the actual act not the necessary cause. It does not say it makes it possible. It is said to actually do it.

Finally even if Christ did die for the whole world and saved them. The atonement would still be limited because creation is thus limited. What needs to be argued is the design of atonement. What God intended... I believe that God could use Christ's atonement anyway He wanted. And because of its infinite worth He would apply it perfectly and completely.

I think God used Christ's death to save from first to last, including faith itself. Thus, the arguement and doctrine of limited atonement talks about the purpose and end of christ's death.

The effects may extend to the whole world but the aim and ultimate end is only toward the elect.

Dave said...

One more thing.

You are wrong about something. Limited atonement does not deny that some effects of Christ death extends to all people. It can avert some temporal wrath but men are still under judgment.

Limited atonement only denies that its God's aim and purpose toward all people.

There are many graces that come from it to all. ie Common grace. Like creation being redeemed. Yet, this kind of grace is in no way the same as saving grace.

I think you confuse the secondary effects of Christ's death with the primarly aim/purpose of His death.

Within the framework of this doctrine of particular redemption, you end up denying that God intends to 'actually' save 'completely' by Christ's infinitely worthy death. I think such a perspective is not speculative but entirely true and biblical.

Dave said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Dave said...

The secondary effects are for the benefit of the elect primarily even if they extend toward all without regard. In this, Common grace is bought on the cross. Yet, it is not the aim of the cross.

"What if God desiring to show his wrath and to make his power known, has endured much patience with vessels of wrath prepared for destruction in order to make know the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy which he has perpared beforehand for Glory."
Romans 9:22-23

The aim of God's patience is for the benefit of those saved. Not those who aren't, even if the ones who aren't save see the effects of the grace. Any good action of God toward people must come from the cross. Some gracious actions are directed toward the reprobate. These are never aim or purpose of Christ's death on the cross.

Paul said...

Dave: You might be right here.

"You are wrong about something. Limited atonement does not deny that some effects of Christ death extends to all people. It can avert some temporal wrath but men are still under judgment.

Limited atonement only denies that its God's aim and purpose toward all people."

My challenge then for both you and Jon is to pu forth a reasonable interpretation of 1 Timothy 2:6, 1 John 2:2, Hebrews 2:9, 1 Corinthians 5:14-15 and John 1:29. All attempts I have read so far from Calvinist authors are attempts to make these verses say things that they aren't saying. I mentioned 1 Timothy 2:6 in my post, because it seems to me that that particular verse cannot be read to say anything but that Christ is a ransom for all men. I don't know what conclusion to draw from that.